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For elections, money isn't everything
Submitted by raideradam on Fri, 06/15/2007 - 11:39am.
The Inquirer did an analysis of campaign money against votes gained. Nutter spent the least per head ... and won.
This is somethign to remember the next person worries about people "buying an election". Sometimes you just need to have faith that the message is more important and if you share it with the masses in an effective way, they will get it and vote appropriately.
the message isn't the only thing
I think it's a fairly limited analysis of the Inquirer article to say that 'the message is more important,' and to discount the ability of money to play a huge stake in an election. After all, Tom Knox did get significantly more votes than three prominent elected officials in the city. He got 71,000 votes--how many of those people had heard of him a year ago? Despite the division that occurred in the Philly progressive community this spring, I think most of us were united on the 'anyone but Knox' program, and that message didn't really resonate with those 71,000 voters.
So what is your
So what is your take?
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"yes adam gave some informative comments but he also seems to sprinkle a little adam dust on it." - merkin
Just that it is too easy to
Just that it is too easy to say that message can't beat money--that's not true every time. Messaging beat money this time, but so did a lot of other things--including strategy and voter discontent.
Yes, the point can be that a
Yes, the point can be that a good message--like Nutter's can outshine a lot of money. A poorly recieved message will not.
Money has greater effect in the Council Races
Its one of 2 reasons that Atlanta's own Bill Green won the election. The other is the name recognition.
Well, for Council At Large I
Well, for Council At Large I can agree with that. At Large races are predominantly advertising. Since you are running against 15 or so other candidates, it is difficult to differentiate yourself from other candidates like you can in a mayoral or district race. In this races you can say "So and so has not done anything for you and I will". Rather hard to do that in At Large races. Those campaigns are different than standard races.
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"yes adam gave some informative comments but he also seems to sprinkle a little adam dust on it." - merkin
Bill Green crushed. He did
Bill Green crushed. He did very well and in a post mortem, I would have to agree that name recognition, money and support in the Northeast and S. Philly shot him past most candidates.
I have critiqued that many of the reform candidates did not do as well as some predicted, but Bill Green's success suggests that the combination of money and name id works. (Remember though he was not running against anyone, so people can vote for him and other candidates.) In a district race, its a binary choice, by selecting one candidate means you want the other candidate to lose. That's why incumbents do so well. If a case has not been made to get them out of office, then no matter how much folks like the challenger(s), they will vote for the incumbent.
Bill Greens election shows why council races should be seperate
from the Mayors Race. Now Bill Greens seems like a decent guy, and I have nothing against him personally. But when it comes to this city...dim bulb. Green over Sharif Street?? Greeen over Marc Stier?? Green over Juan Ramos?? Green over Derek Green???? Not if these races got the attention the Mayors race did. He'd be exposed for the political aspiring non public, non Philadelphia loyal guy that he is. My apologies if Im offending anyone here, but I can't believe the citizens of Philadelphia put him in office over so many other very qualified candidates. Bill Green getting in is the equivalent of Bob Brady winning this past May.....a product of the machine and backroom politics instead of the most hard working and qualified.
best thing about the Green campaign
My favorite things were the "FED UP?" stickers on the Daily News. i dont know who gets credit for that one but those were hilarious.
They were just these little pissed-off rage-filled stickers!
Sitting there on your newspaper, being pissed off!
I didn't think stickers could be angry!
(you know, I should write a top ten of the year...maybe after TBA)
speaking of Top Ten....
I am trying to think of a list of the best quotes this year. Top Ten obnoxious or funny things people said to the press. You get less points if you were too much of a wuss to use your name.
I would like to hear what people say...however...
When it's all said and done, I am pretty damn sure that the Single Best Quote of the Year Award goes hands down to John Dougherty, who, in December made his commentary about Bob Brady running for mayor:
"He can't out-Irish me, he can't out-Catholic me, he can't out-union me, he can't out-rowhome me," Dougherty said of Brady yesterday...
"And I'm looking forward to talking about the issues."
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Other suggestions?
This Brady quote is hilarious
At a forum, Mayoral Candidate Bob Brady was asked , "Do you support abstinence only education?". He responded, "Uhhh I support all types of education." ha! I bet he can't spell abstinence.
Name Recognition, Really?
You've been harping about Bill Green winning because of name recognition, but that's simply not true. If who your dad is was really that much of a factor in victory, than Street should have won since his dad is the sitting mayor. Green's father left the mayor's office nearly 25 years ago. A lot of people have left the city, died and relocated to Philly since 1984. Most voters 40 to 45 and under probably don't know about the Green family legacy.
Mayor Street may only have an approval rating in the 20s, but that still means about 150,000 voters like him. If name recognition was as important as you say, then Sharif Street should have been able to get a third of those people who like his dad to vote for him, and that would have been enough votes to win.
Before you continue your naive diatribe about how the most qualified guy never wins, look at Nutter. He raised more money than everyone but Knox, and as a result, was able to get his message out to more voters than any other candidate except Knox. The reality of politics at all levels is that you need money to get your message out to voters. Green did this, and people clearly liked what they heard. He ran a better campaign than everyone else. Maybe Derek Green was really the best man for the job, but he failed to communicate that to the voters.
Monsoon, quote me correctly........
I never said the most qualified guy never wins, I was pointing out how Bill Green won off of Name recognition. Much like Frank Rizzo, and Goode have done. But Goode and Rizzo had good resume's to begin with, not to mention lifelong residencies in Philly. If you believe he is the most qualified, thats fine, but most believe that a man who decided to enter the race last minute, who had just returned to the city from ATL, won over the voters wtih his policy and knowledge. He won with his name and lots of money poured into the machine.
I'm sure Milton steet and Ben Ramos received a thank you card from him.
So why didn't Shariff win
You've totally avoided the point of my post, which is that if name recognition was so crucial for Green, then why did Shariff lose even though he has far better name recognition (again, sitting Mayor vs Mayor nearly 25 years ago)?
Sharif came in a close 6th!
If it wasnt for Uncle Milty, he would have pulled it off. Green is a name with a legacy in this city of both his father and his grandfather. The voters in the northeast and south philly who have lived here for generations were loyal to that comforting political name.
But since I am open to all opinions, you're pointing out that he didnt win mainly off of his name...then please do tell how he won?
how much did bill green
how much did bill green spend? do you guys know?
He spent close to 400G's.
He spent close to 400G's. Tops for all Council at large candidates.
When Milton Street can get
When Milton Street can get 10,000 votes, it shows that that people got the button confused with Sharif.
I have known Sharif for a little while, and he is a good guy that is well respected leader of the city.
There were a lot of candidates that were all around good people like Rodney Little,Derek Green, Andy Toy.
When there are 19 candidates there are hundreds of reasons why who won and who lost.
Hopefully Bill Green can prove some of the skeptics wrong, and deliver services to the city.
Re: Sharif + Bill Green
My father-in-law had Sharif Street as a student @ Central High, + says good things about him. As for Bill Green, he has attended a meeting of Drinking Liberally: Mount Airy (his wife has attended several), + I have to say that I like the man. He seems to know his stuff, + comes from a long line of people who have served this city.
Being the scion of a famous name isn't a bad thing, as I'm sure people who know Councilman Goode would agree. Frank Rizzo Jr. has also been a decent Council member.
-Z
RE: Sharif
Its a shame that both name recognition and name confusion had sooo much to do with this election. Most analyst agree that if it not for Ben Ramos and Uncle Milty Street....Councilwoman Blondell certainly would have not gotten that 5th spot.
milton street got 10K
milton street got 10K votes????
holy shit. i have to look at the returns again.
we really need some new last names in politics in this town!!!
Back to the orginal question
If you have enough money . . . i.e. enough to communicate to everyone who only watches TV commercials and you have a small army of unexperienced but dedicated vollunteers to do for free the GOTV work that other campaigns pay people to do. If you have those two things and you spend your money well, then you can win with less money. Nutter's win showed that first and foremost. He also showed that he's excellent at making the most of limited resources - something that will hopefully serve him well as Philly's next mayor.
Beyond that, while Nutter spent less per vote by half what virtually every other campaign did - in the end he spent more money total than every body else but Knox.
Having a strong message, building a strong dedicated following of people who really believed - those things helped him immensely but it still does not happen without enough cash to reach out to folks who do not read the newspaper, much less blogs.
In terms of City Council at Large, based on Center City and University City conidered alone, Andy Toy actually not only surpassed Sharif and Bill Green, he was actually the top vote getter well past Councilman Kenney . . . but he was virtually unknown out in the neighborhoods and he did buy a citywide street team like Green did.
RE: Andy Toy
This young man did a great job that the media didn't embrace enough....i think he will make another run next term..but who does he target? Greenlee? Green? Blondell?